Loot drama

Well I know Dvahlish has had experience with loot "drama", who else here has had to deal with this? In my case last night it wasn't somebody complaining that they wanted the loot but more of whether the distribution was fair or not. Obviously there will always be someone who has a problem with whichever loot system is used so maybe that someone was me this time but I know I wasn't alone.

Well it was in Gruuls when we had just downed High King Maulgar and were about to distribute the loot. Since it was a pug group we were just using the need before greed system instead of the epgp addon our guild usually uses in 25-mans. The mace was promptly rolled on and one of the pallys won it fair and square. Then there were the 3 tier 4 tokens, 1 hunter/mage/lock and 2 druid/warrior/priest. The first was rolled on by who needed it the most and everyone seemed happy but then the next two tokens was where I had a problem with it. Since it was a need before greed system, the loot master told everyone who was interested in it to link their current shoulders to determine who needed it the most. A druid tank had blue shoulders and myself and two others had gladiator epic shoulders. One of the two pieces was given outright to the druid tank because she was the only one still wearing a blue, this is where I have a problem.

First everyone interested in the piece "needs" it, it would have been a big upgrade for us all. Second the druid was technically someone's alt, though she seemed offended at people calling it an alt. I guess if I was in her position I wouldn't want a disadvantage just because it wasn't my main, but at the same time if you already have a geared up toon someone elses main should get a shot before an alt. Lastly the only epic shoulders I have are the gladiator shoulders, if I didn't have these I would still be wearing a blue, and anyone can get gladiator shoulders. They aren't even pve gear, its basically free epics. So you could look at it like I didn't even have shoulders for a pve set. I'm not saying I should have gotten them outright like she did, I just think she should have had to roll like the rest of us. Anyways I lost the roll on the 2nd token that dropped, there were several more people rolling for it.

So I guess what I'm looking for, am I way off on this or do you guys agree with me? I guess I'm also just ranting.

Personally, no, I don't agree with you, although that could be my inner tank speaking up.

First of all, tank's cannot use gladiator's gear to the effective level that healers and dps-ers can, as sad as that is. There is no gladiator tanking set, for any class.

If you have an epic, and another person doesn't, it stands to reason that they should get the epic before you. Its just not as much of an upgrade to you as it is to the tank, in this case. You have epic shoulders and she has blues. Upgrading from a blue to an epic gives a much higher bonus than upgrading from an epic to a different epic that's about the same level (honestly, they really are, despite their stat focus being different).

Saying that they shouldn't be able to get a piece just because they're not the person's main is just stupid, honestly. So what? Who cares if its an alt? If I have a main who's got full S3 gear, should I be not included in the raid gear for a different character, who isn't fully geared? No, because its still stuff I need, because its not the same character. So what that I've already gotten a character geared? This is a different character, one who isn't geared.

And last, think about it from the raid leader's perspective. If you give the gear to a dpser or a healer first, it just gives them more and more threat. You have to have a well geared tank to keep threat, that's just how it works. The raid leader has to think about that too, so giving the gear up to a tank, just so that they continue to be useful to the group makes sense to me. Having a useless tank pretty much makes the raid wipe, so they have to be on the cutting edge of the gear for whatever dungeon/raid you're running.

Sorry, you ranted and I ranted right back at you.

Well, i was in the group as well and had my own issues with the whole distribution. I do have decent shoulders, i think from kara(not sure). They are ok, but def better than some of the other raiders. So me being excited about the drop wait until the raid leader calls out that were going to decide on the t4 druid, war, priest. So I roll, and get a 95. Now i know it was a little early to roll, but it wasnt like i rolled during a different item or wayyy before or anything. So then the dilemma begins on who should get them. So we finally decide that the OT gets the first drop. Then everyone else is told to roll on the 2nd one. So im like, yo i just rolled a 95 a min ago for these and theyre all like, no doesnt count u lose. so i dont get them and im mad.
NOW, I do see where PJ is coming from. Im in the middle since i see the issues the raid leader would have and stuff, but since I was involved I have the perspective of not getting the loot which everyone wants. O well maybe next time.

See, in that case its a little different. You already rolled, and they didn't count it. That would piss me off. I would have exactly the same problems you do with that. Because you rolled, and you rolled early, they said it didn't count. You still rolled, though, so it should count. They should have given you the other one. At least, that's my point of view.

Ya i mean in a normal instance when the leader calls out the piece that is going to be rolled on next, ppl roll. I didnt know it was going to turn into a 5 minute argument otherwise i would have waited...

Yeah it really was ridiculous how long it took to give all the loot out because of all the arguing, I admit I had a part in it but I just wanted it to be fair for me.

Roll for it.
I have known ppl that have worn lesser items in raids JUST so that they get the loots that drop, because it makes them look like they need it more.

When we have these problems...it always comes down to a roll..that way NOONE can complain because it is fair and random.

Also...does your guild have DKP? That is a fairer way of a loot system aswell.

We usually use EPGP which is a DKP variant addon but since this was just a pug we didn't use it this time. I definitely wouldn't have gotten anything if we went epgp because that was my first 25man raid...

Originally Posted by Dvahlish

When we have these problems...it always comes down to a roll..that way NOONE can complain because it is fair and random.

My words exactly. But no one seemed to want to listen to me...

Let me tell you of a story about an adorable hunter named Arrowcrazy who had to put up with some of the worst raid and guild leading ever in hopes that if he stayed loyal he would be geared....but he wasnt. Because said hunter was better at PVP then his guild he was expected to gear himself with pvp in order to join the raid once in the raid however said hunter is looked over because he already has epics.....that dont come with enough agility, hit rating, or intellect but he's still looked over cause he's sporting epic pvp gear. I do not agree with people being over looked there is too much of a difference between pve and pvp gear to make someone try to raid in pvp gear then mock them because people in half kara epics / half blues are out DPS'ing them.

ex

Hunter S3 legs have about 60 ap Hunter T6 legs have about 110 ap
""""""""""""""""""""""""" 20 int """"""""""""""""""""""""" 54 int
""""""""""""""""""""""""" 30 agi """"""""""""""""""""""""" 60 agi

So i dont want to hear anyone saying that damned drood shouldnt get T4 shoulders because he has epic gladiator shoulders thats bull**** pve gear is needed to be any good at DPS/tanking/healing and anyone who disagrees probably hasnt even seen hyjal yet.